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 Post subject: Future AGDI Projects
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 7:54 pm 
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Hi everyone- first off I'd like to say thanks for all the hard work and scrutiny you've endured along this long road- few people understand what it takes to make a truly great game and I think you folks have got it down.  I've been hanging around the forums anonymously for about a year now and I figured it's time to add my two cents to the community here.

Are there any plans on what is to follow Quest for Glory II?  I realize we may be looking down a long tunnel, but I'd be very interested to hear what AGDI has planned or has even considered for the future.  Personally, I'd like to see a remake of Quest for Glory III- a complete version of the game, as the Coles intended it to be.  Somehow, the game seemed like it was made by putting together every other scene and calling it good.

Now, I realize that the main argument against this project would be that there's already a VGA version of the game.  But is that simply the intent here to upgrade the graphics?  In my opinion, if that were true we'd have had QFG2VGA a long while ago.  No, in the process of beautifying the game the ADGI crew has taken the time to actually complete the game, to add in the features nerfed by Sierra and to even consult with the original creators of the series to make this game better.  I don't believe projects like this are simply to improve graphics at all, but rather to enhance and revive the adventure gaming experience.  As such, I believe that we should be open to the idea of remaking VGA games as well.

Anyway, that's my take on the subject.  Thanks again for all the hard work guys and I welcome your replies.



--Josh


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 8:20 pm 
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When it comes down to it, what I think is trying to be accomplished is to remake the games at the same level as Sierra did with their VGA remakes.  I believe it's been stated before but any remake on a VGA game would simply be bug fixing, and there are already script patches that do that, so there is no reason to do so.  Look at the remake of QFG1. Did Sierra add in any noticeable new content?  Not really.  The only thing that really comes to mind is the addition of a couple more notes between B and B.  

If you're talking about KQ2... well, I can't say I entirely understand their reasons for adding in so much new content other than the original game was sloppily put together.  Almost no depth was in it, it was just a fast puzzle solve to rescue the girl.  There was no storyline really.

Not trying to put you down or anything.  It's just my opinion.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 9:26 pm 
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I really don't think remaking QFG3 is worth the time and effort it'd take. Yeah, we'd have the graphics already, but:

1) It wouldn't look good. Sierra used 256 colors in their games. We use 32-bit color. Literally using the graphics from the old QFG3-game would mean we wouldn't live up to the standard we've been working to set with our current work.

2) It takes a crazy amount of time to script. QFG-games require a lot of work...more than any standard adventure because of all the variables included. Seriously, we'd be talking about another 4 years here probably.

3) The net result doesn't justify the amount of work, as there's already timer patches to stomp out the more insidious bugs in the game and what we'd come out with wouldn't be worth the amount of work, even if we did add a few things here and there.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:09 am 
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Curiously, what would you thinkt the Coles intended in QFGIII that wasn't in the game?

I think it's the weakest of the series, personally, so I'd be interested to see what people think needed to be fixed and/or what the Coles wanted.


Bt

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:36 am 
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I don't think asking volunteers to remake QG3 is necessary. However, it was my favorite in the series as a kid, until QG4 came out. As with most QFG games, I think the fans mostly want to open doors that can't be opened - in this case, something like sneaking into the eastern section of Tarna, or seeing more of a city that looks so massive in the overhead view.

I loved QG3 because I have always been a huge culture/anthropology junkie, and this game added a really exotic/foreign aspect to the series. Devon really stands out in a world of people who look different and don't speak his language, but it was really fun to be in a setting that's very unusual for games of this genre. I liked the Simbani, and would have enjoyed hearing more stories or seeing things going on around the bonfire.

I know just about everyone would have wanted to see more of the Lost City/Demon culture (and more challenging enemies to fight there).. it would have been exciting if Devon had to really search for the Anubis relief, and then after that, search through the inside of the city to find the room with Frik and Frac (frik and frac?).

Oh, and the anthill! A big old sidequest for Fighters to find and slay the queen (and stop ants from appearing in the game - they were annoying).

More to do/eat in the Heart of the World.

Better monsters, maybe based on North African or Egyptian myths or cryptids.

The game really spans a massive amount of territory and has enormous potential for the Coles to add more side quests and other stuff, if they ever had the time, money, and desire.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:59 pm 
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Things to improve in QFG3?  More class specific quests.  The thief  barely gets anything to do, as Tarna is so law-abiding that you can't steal.  Sure you can steal from the Laibon and from the Leopard man leader, but that's about  it.  The Wizard could have more to do than get a piece of wood.  >.<  The Fighter and Paladin, I feel, are the only classes with something big, and that's the Simbani initiation.  But yea, it's just not worth the effort to remake.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:15 pm 
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Wouldn't Qfg5 make a better candidate for a remake?

Reimagining the current scrolling backgrounds into non scrolling, Vga backgrounds.

Making all quests completable for all of the 4 gameplay styles, making the combats a unique and intelligent experience for all 4 classes instead of the mouse clicking craze it was.

Overhauling the skill system which works less and less when your skills maximum simply has to increase from 400 to 500, and the swim skill which was completly useless.

Adding the familiar idea from the Qfg5 thread in the off topic section...

Replacing most of the recurring characters from previous games with new, unseen before, characters, and simply making the recurring characters visit Silmaria a couple of days in the entire game, not unlike Qfg2 where some days you could see the poets, some days you could see the beggar and some other days you could see Shema dances... (Maybe one caravan from one region of Gloriana at the time)

Qfg3 is weaker than the other games but I still have fun playing it, I don't consider it any less a Quest for Glory game and except for adding a couple subquests for the magic user and thief classes, I don't see what else could be added. But when I play Qfg5 I can't stop imagining how it could have been if it was made in the same style as the previous games and if the Coles didn't put all of these recurring characters from the old games to please all the fans, which ended up pleasing none.

Of course such project will never see the light of day, it is simply too big for an inexperienced group to undertake, AGD# will move to Himalaya's projects, IA will be busy for a long time with QfI and their current projects, same for Hero6, but I can't stop dreaming when I play that game.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 5:44 am 
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Blackthorne519 wrote:
Curiously, what would you thinkt the Coles intended in QFGIII that wasn't in the game?


Well, it's been stated that the project was rushed from the beginning.  There's places on the map, for example that aren't accessible- the most famous of which would be the ant hill.  Given the grandeur of the land and the cultures in Fricana, the game barely scratches the surface of what could be much better explained in terms of the people and the history of the land.  Take Shadows of Darkness for example- Mordavia has a rich history that's explained in detail in the game and plays a very forward role in the plot.  From the interviews I've read with Lori, I would imagine that simply because of the completeness of Gloriana in her own head there would be more to Wages of War.  Perhaps nothing specific was ever mentioned but that's my impression.

I'm kind of anthropology freak as well, so maybe some fanfic is in order? :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 5:47 am 
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One thing I will add to this discussion that may be contrary to my own point is that with the advent of MMOs, our definition of the scope of a world has broadened somewhat.  I concede that it'd be quite difficult to cram all of that in a Sierra-style adventure game, especially in such a time-pressed plot line in Wages of War.  It'd be wicked cool though :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2007 6:33 am 
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Something else to keep in mind.  QFG3 wasn't planned originally in Lori's head.  It was added in when they felt the Hero hadn't matured enough to deal with the stuff in Shadows of Darkness.  It's understandable why it seems weak in comparison to the others.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:41 am 
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It was weak to me because it was clunky.
Note it was their first run on a point and click interface so they had a lot of learning to do. Also the combat took one GIANT step back from qfg2 which is still my favorite combat system.
It was rushed too which really complicated things seeing as they had to learn a whole new way of doing things and had to make art about 20 times more complex than they were use to.

A lot of people don't understand that jumps from one type of gameplay to another (No matter how small) can be a big undertaking.
Take for instence mario world to mario 64. That was amazing they pulled it off so well.
Now look at Sonic and Sonic adventure... Yeah not sure much.
Mostly first jumps you need to be forgiving but they usually clean it up as they go.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 6:48 am 
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Ok, so, did anyone try and contact Lori to find out whether there was 'supposedly' more to the game? (I'm not talking about some interview... I mean contacting her and getting the information)


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:51 am 
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First post, but long time visitor... (you can see my failed register a temps from back in 2003) Anyway instead of remaking QFG3 how about just making a patch that fixes the point system bugs and adds some content to round off the character skills? The game is defiantly geared for the Fighter/Paladin classes, and adding a side quest for the Mage and Thief class seem like a possibility.

An ant hill side quest seems like it could work for all classes. Quest would be to destroy the nest.
Fighter/ Paladin would attack though the ant horde, once finished would through rocks to make the nest the crumble down
Mage uses Juggling Lights to distract the ant horde, and then cast Force Bolt and to make the nest the crumble down
Thief would sneak in, climb the nest, search the nest, find a crack, and pick the crack to make the nest the crumble down (Thief could climb up and down the ant hill, and continue to pick the rocks to gain experience.)

Additional Thief Side quest(s)? (Trying to keep it simple)
If this was to be there are three places where it could be done.
1)North Bazaar where the money change is (Single Room inside the money changers)
2)East of the Open Air Bazaar (Requires new “shady” section of the map, and some type of room to rob.)
3)East of the City Gates. (Requires new “shady” section of the map, and some type of room to rob.)

As for the graphics, despite the fact they are 256 colors, the hold up pretty darn well. The biggest color issue would be with the sprites, not the back grounds.

I would be willing to help if someone has the knowhow to do it. SCI Studio 3.x would be the best option to create a patch, but someone would have to add support in the program because its currently incomplete. http://bripro.com/scistudio/index.php. Help might be able to come from http://freesci.linuxgames.com/ because they are working on creating an engine that will run the SCI1.1/SCI2 engine anyway. You could also use the FreeSCI engine instead as well.

Anyway those are my thoughts.

I am open to suggestions.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 5:34 pm 
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honestly I the only problem I had with qfg3 was that it was fighter/paladin friendly. Which was fine if you were that class but the thief and magic user got a quite a bit less to do. It wasn't too bad for the magic user cause we had the making the staff and fighting the leopardman wizard (in my opinion was one of the best wizard puzzles in the series).

Plus in all the games you did most of your magic in the forest/jungle/savanna/desert. The thief got a couple times where he got to steal stuff (drum from labion hut, spear from village), but it was disappointing compared to all the stuff you did in qfg2.
At least we get the skill aerobics.

I didn't not like any of the QFG games. I enjoyed them all.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 7:33 pm 
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Unfortunately QG3 was a technology demonstrator as well, so they probably oped to keep the game short while testing the various changes to the engine.
I actually had a tour a tour of Sierra in Coarsegold CA back in 1991 while they were working on QG3. One of the parts that I remember the best about the trip was one of the artist working on doing touch ups to the closeup in the Kings chamber in Tarna, that and bowling and watching movies in the hotel room (Defending Your Life), and the fact the the city had only one traffic light at the time, and it was movable, but I digress.

For me QG3 was a wasted opportunity, perhaps in hind site they should have sunk their time into QG3 instead of QG5, All the games had good continuity until 5. If I had to rate the games, they would be 4, 1, 3/2 tie for different reasons and finally 5.

I actually liked the combat system in 3, its was a good cross between 1 and 2  which is probably why they were going for, but it was unpolished.

Out of all the games QG3 had/has the greatest potential for improvement, providing someone is willing to go more in depth. As I said before I would be willing the help out in a extended version of the game, One of the things I am best at is writing into and existing story and keeping within defined limitations. I think that KQ2 was a good example. I don't think I would take it as far as AGD, but their adaption was very good none the less.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:30 am 
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IF AGDI were to make another remake (which I doubt), I think there would be no point in remaking another QFG (after remaking Trial by fire, I mean). Sure, they have some weak points, but they still are among the greatest games ever created and the series stands up pretty well despite its "flaws". There are many other games that actually need an update much more than any QFG game.

There are other teams working in SQ2, KQ4, Colonel's bequest and SQ3 so that still leaves, at least: PQ2, Gold rush, Iceman, Camelot, Larry 2 & 3 and Manhunter 1 & 2. Any of those games would benefit far more from an enhancement.

Just my two cents.

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 Post subject: JK
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:37 pm 
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haradan wrote:
There are other teams working in...Colonel's bequest...


You sure about that one? :lol

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 5:40 pm 
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haradan wrote:
There are other teams working in SQ2, KQ4, Colonel's bequest and SQ3 so that still leaves, at least: PQ2, Gold rush, Iceman, Camelot, Larry 2 & 3 and Manhunter 1 & 2. Any of those games would benefit far more from an enhancement.

Just my two cents.


I totally agree with you AGD should not spend their time remaking QG3. Out of all the games you listed, I think Codename: Iceman would be the best one. Its a good standalone story. If they wanted to stick to fairy tails then perhaps they can remake Black Cauldron. Thats a nice and simple one, though Disney might get pissed.


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 Post subject: Re: JK
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:37 pm 
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Brainiac wrote:
haradan wrote:
There are other teams working in...Colonel's bequest...


You sure about that one? :lol


He might have seen it on Kazaa.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:51 pm 
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ROFL

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:43 pm 
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I would really like to see another team form-up and complete another remake.

As much as I love AGDI and the work IA's done, I'd love to see more people come together and with gumption and hard work, produce a game.  It'd just be nice to see.


Bt

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 Post subject: Other projects
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:27 pm 
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Haradan the red press is working on a remake of PQ 2. here is the link
http://www.novellice.com/theRedPress/?page_id=54

John


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 Post subject: Hi
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:38 pm 
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You know what I wanna see? I want Robin Hood: Conquest of the Longbow remake! With professional voices, enhanced plot and story. You can be as evil as you want or good as you want. Different endings for the path you choose.

More to do in town, more disguises etc... lol.

What do you say?

Till nextime stay cool  :hat


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:57 pm 
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What is it with the insane amount of people wanting to remake games that are already in VGA? It's not worth the effort, I say. Besides that, Longbow is fine the way it is.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 1:42 am 
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How about "Gold Rush!"?  Definitely not VGA, could use some polishing, and highly underrated.


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