KQ2+ and Redux mythology question (MEGA SPOILERS AWOO)

[psychosis090]

Are the Ancients and First Mages both seperate species/groups, or are they merely the same thing but in different forms (spiritual/corporeal and passive/active)?

I know that both names are used interchangeably in both games to refer to the immortal, immensely powerful magicians who descended from 'The Heavens' and started/nurtured human civilisation. However, in the KQ2+ manual, it states that the Ancients 'left the world', leaving behind only the renegade entity that eventually becomes the Door of Destiny. It is also made clear that he is the only one of his 'kind' left in the world. Is this reference to 'leaving' literal or metaphorical? As in, they cast off their recognisable spiritual forms and assumed those of immortal humans, thus making it appear as if the Ancients just up and left?

Also, the form and function of both the 'Ancients' described in the KQ2+ prologue and the First Mages seems to differ somewhat. The First Mages used their knowledge and magical mastery to directly influence the world and events happening within it (which eventually got out of hand and lead to the Great War). The Ancients in the prologue, however, could essentially perceive destiny and the span of time itself, gaining unfathomable knowledge and acting as passive caretakers for the world (in theory, at least).

Although the KQ2+ prologue clearly distinguishes between the Ancients and the First Mages, all the supplementary material within the games use these names interchangeably. This implies a few possibilities:

1. The First Mages were so old and powerful, that to the general population they might as well have been the Ancients, so they just started calling them that.

2. The First Mages are simply the Ancients in humanoid, corporeal form; sacrificing their absolute knowledge of destiny/time for immortality and powerful magic. However, given the trouble caused by the pre-Door-of-Destiny, the question is: why? Note also that the Door of Destiny is the only one left in the world who possesses the Ancients' clairvoyance, making him the last of his 'kind'.

3. The Ancients came, imprisoned what's-his-face and then left. Then the First Mages (a seperate group) descended from 'The Heavens' and started civilisation. The most likely possibility, but then again it's the hokiest. TWO immensely powerful races descending from the Heavens and nurturing civilisation, one after another? Puh-lease.

4. The First Mages are a race created by the Ancients and are supposed to act as both the inheritors and new custodians of the world when they finally left. This also explains their perceived extra-terrestrial origin (being born of the Ancients, who are most likely from the Heavens, makes them technically from the Heavens). Maybe they were sent down to earth by the Ancients (as opposed to being birthed on earth), giving the impression that the First Mages came from somewhere else?

Anyone know the answer? It's been bugging me, and now I have a headache from typing all this nonsense.

[psychosis090]

Anyone?

[Erpy]

The only person to really answer those questions would be Daniel, our writer.

The games do make a difference between the two. I think a fairly accurate description would be to see the Ancients as gods and the First Mages as demigods or very gifted humans. There's little revealed about the former...other than the fact they mostly sought knowledge and did not feel like participating in the world's life cycle, merely observe unless absolutely necessary. (it's quite possible the oracle is an Ancient, though that's a guess) The latter were stated to be the founders of Daventry (Legenimor specifically), but they were more human-like...with personality flaws like greed and lust for power and actively interacted with the world. The Father and Seran are both First Mages. (and Smaude is a direct descendant) Normal humans were already present while the First Mages were around, btw.

[Anonymous Game Creator 2]

Here's the info that I was able to strangle out of Wookie:

The Ancients were the original visitors to the world. Aliens, basically. They "seeded" the world with magic and magical beings. Their "children" were the First Mages, who took it upon themselves to rule... until one of them decided that wasn't how it should be...

[psychosis090]

Here's the info that I was able to strangle out of Wookie:

The Ancients were the original visitors to the world. Aliens, basically. They "seeded" the world with magic and magical beings. Their "children" were the First Mages, who took it upon themselves to rule... until one of them decided that wasn't how it should be...

Ah! Had a feeling that was case. And I really can't thank you enough for asking Wookie himself! Cheers!

I

[DrJones]

Wow! In KQ2+ universe, scienciology is the true religion!

[Brainiac]

Wow! In KQ2+ universe, scienciology is the true religion!

I knew it, Wookie is really Lord Xenu!

[Lambonius]

Here's the info that I was able to strangle out of Wookie:

The Ancients were the original visitors to the world. Aliens, basically. They "seeded" the world with magic and magical beings. Their "children" were the First Mages, who took it upon themselves to rule... until one of them decided that wasn't how it should be...

Hahaha...thank god it wasn't explained that way in the actual games. It'd be Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull all over again.

[MusicallyInspired]

Here's the info that I was able to strangle out of Wookie:

The Ancients were the original visitors to the world. Aliens, basically. They "seeded" the world with magic and magical beings. Their "children" were the First Mages, who took it upon themselves to rule... until one of them decided that wasn't how it should be...

Hahaha...thank god it wasn't explained that way in the actual games. It'd be Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull all over again.

I actually liked that movie. Also, I don't subscribe to the belief that just because that movie exists that aliens were behind everything in the series. But that's another topic.

[Lambonius]

I actually liked that movie. Also, I don't subscribe to the belief that just because that movie exists that aliens were behind everything in the series. But that's another topic.

I liked it, too. I was merely suggesting that you'd be hearing a lot of "WTF!?! ALEINS DONTS BELING IN KIGNS UQEST!!!1!"

[MusicallyInspired]

Heh to be sure.