Future remake? (archived)

[Chris]

PQ2 was a good game, I just found it a bit too linear and once I completed it, never played it again. I'd prefer a game like KQ3 which has a higher replay value for a remake.

Before anyone says it, yes I know SQ2 was pretty linear too

[Erpy]

Yup, SQ2 was pretty linear and SQ2VGA wouldn't have had an enhanced plot or something. This means that most of the differences between Kippesoep's game and ours would be cosmetical. If Kippesoep were to cancel his project (but lets be realistic, he wrote his own engine for the project. I doubt he'd cancel it now) we could always pick up where we left off.

FullJee, the amount of posts in a page is an option that can be changed in the settings of your account. On my computer this thread is still 1 page long. And I read every new message in every public folder whenever I check the forums, so no need to post additional posts to draw my attention.

I understand you feel disappointed, but right now there's no reason to get depressed just because we leave the remaking of a certain game to someone else. Yes, Kippesoep hardly ever gives screenshots or progress reports, but neither did we about this project. Some teams spend a lot of time on playable demos and other things to keep the fanbase interested, but at the same time, overall progress is slowed down. Kippesoep has a lot of experience and I trust he knows what he's doing.

I suppose this is obvious to most, but I'll repeat it here: if Kippesoep finishes his project, Tierra won't remake SQ2. I myself don't see any reasons why SQ3VGA would be an impossibility after Kippesoep's project is finished, but there's no point in remaking a game that's already remade. After all, it still takes months of work and I doubt many people would anticipate the release of an already remade game as much as they would anticipate the release of a game that never received the VGA-treatment.

Look on the bright side; we were still in a rather early stage of development with SQ2, so if Kippesoep wouldn't have mentioned his project before, we would have had more trouble on our hands in the future. Also, we can spend the time that would have been invested in SQ2 on another project while SQ2 is still remade at the same time.

I hope that answers your question.

[The Infamous Mecha Sonic]

Did you have any of the art done for Space Quest II? If so, why not put it up?

[Erpy]

Yes, we have some art done for SQ2. I haven't discussed this with AGD2 yet, but my suggestion would be not to put any of the SQ2-art online for the following reasons:

1) Showing the art of a game that's likely to be discontinued is like saying to everyone: "See these pictures? That's what you will never play."

2) People have different tastes. Some people will like our backgrounds better, others will think the ones in Kippesoep's version are better. My question would be; if one of the two versions is going to be discontinued, what use would it be to show screenshots and sort of create a group of fans that favors the backgrounds of a non-existent game?

We'd risk pulling people away from Kippesoep's project while we can't offer something to act as a replacement. That would sort of harm Kippesoep's game and it wouldn't be in our interest. Get my drift?

[The Infamous Mecha Sonic]

I don't see how posting a few screenshots could pull fans away from Kippesoep's game. They're want to play the game, not look at pictures of the background art from a game that will never exist. But I can see how it could cause a conflict in the matter of whose art was better...

[Anonymous Game Creator 2]

I won't show the art, but we might as well show the demo of the game, just so people can see how it was coming along.

You can check it out here

There's not much to speak of really. It's just a very early demo of the first few game screens. A few animations from the control room (plus the shuttle bay screen) have been made, but are missing from this demo. Anyhow.. nothing too fancy, but it should give you an idea of the type of  advancements we've made since KQ1VGA.

[Erpy]

Interesting. Now I see what you meant when you were talking about a different style from what was done in KQ1VGA. Still, it feels quite like the classic SQ's.

Since the demo only features three rooms, I guess it doesn't really matter THAT much since there's hardly enough art to make a clear comparison between SQ2VGA and what Kippesoep's project will end up looking like. (at least, I don't intend to draw conclusions from the early concept sketches he put on his site)

[Kurdt]

Wow. That was some great art, and some of the new little jokes you guys had put into it were really funny (YOINK! heheh, priceless). Whenever you remake SQ3, it will certainly be something that I will anticipate the most just because of what I've seen of these few screens!

It is very honorable of you to stop the SQ2VGA project on account of Kippesoep. I know his game will definitely be a good one and will live up to the high standard of quality that has been set by people such as Tierra. FullJee, don't let life or the cancellation of this project get you down. If there's anything I've learned, it's that nothing lasts forever. Just wait the few short months for KQ2+, anticipate the release of QFG2VGA, and wait for even bigger things to come from Tierra and other dedicated fan projects!

-----------------------

Kurt Rayner

Smart men don't make the world, smart and courageous ones do.

[Fender178]

not bad of start its awesome.

Edited by: Fender178 at: 6/26/02 8:07:16 pm

[Penner Theologius Pott]

Hey, I've said it before, I'll throw it in again...the project I'd absolutely love to see from you guys is an original one.

How's that for an option on the poll?

[Menbailee]

I think I have to add to the voices admiring Tierra's professionalism in this matter. Tierra already has a larger fanbase, having a label and a highly successful remake already released, and you probably would have been capable of out-publicity-ing Kippesoep, regardless of whose game was "better." It's another mark of good faith on Tierra's part that they're engaging the fangame community generally in a spirit of teamwork. Looking at Kippesoep's preliminary art and the Tierra demo, I do believe that we'd be looking at two top-notch projects, with preferences between the two being simply a matter of taste--I think that renderings would suit the SQ tech landscape, for example, whereas purists might demand only hand-drawn art.

I liked the demo! The backgrounds were both great-looking and authentic Space Quest, with the only possible critique being that artists of your caliber could actually take more license in redesigning the rooms (SQ1VGA looked quite different from SQ1AGI, after all--though purists, again, would give you heat). Out of curiosity, what ratio of original/borrowed graphics was Tierra planning on for the final game? The airlock was the same room out of the Deltaur in SQ1VGA, and Roger's removing the spacesuit looked like the loop from SQ1VGA in reverse.
My vote for the next project was Conquests of Camelot. It's a game which played with the classic adventure game setup very creatively in its day, such that the different solutions to problems made a difference in Arthur's ability to claim the grail. It's also a game in which the point'n'click interface would be a welcome upgrade, since I remember finding its parser particularly cantankerous. I'd have to agree that KQ3 would be an excellent game to see remade by Tierra, but that they might do best to take on a project from another series to show the breadth of their abilities.

[TheMnomen]

It makes me feel a little amazed that SQ1 has never even been spoken of. Why not add that to the list? Tierra remade KQ1, which in many people's opinion is not as good as 2 and 3, but when it comes to SQ, Tierra completely skipped the first one, and went to 2. Not only that, but I doubt SQ1 would take that long compared to the other projects. Prolly a third of the amount of time taken in completing KQ1.

[The Infamous Mecha Sonic]

Er, Space Quest I was already remade in VGA by Sierra.

[heyjupiter617]

Again...I WILL be your love slave if you re-make KQ3

[Anonymous Game Creator 2]

Penner: AGD1 is making an original game here: www.himalayastudios.com

So there's no need to choose - you can have both!

Menbailee: Yes, some of the graphics and animations have been re-used from SQ1 VGA, but mainly for the purpose of authenticity. Early research we did showed that most people wanted the backgrounds to look the same style as the original Sierra games did in order to preserve the 'feel'. Most people stated clearly that they didn't want much changed around, but to keep that authentic landscape of the original backgrounds intact. It will be interesting to see what the response to KQ2VGA is in this respect, since a lot of backgrounds and geography has been drastically altered.

As for the animations, I'm sure that not many people are aware of the time it takes to make a 2-3 second animation. For example, with an animation of Roger removing his suit, I'd be looking at 2-3 hours non-stop to make that animation and get it looking as good as the animations in SQ1VGA. Then there's finding the motivation to actually sit there for 3 hours tidying up little pixels on the screen:) It just seems redundant to make new animations when the necessary animations already exist. Where possible, we've taken measures to make them look different in some way (ie. Roger wears a white suit, instead of a blue one). But spending extra time creating new animations for ones that already exist (and for a game that isn't our own to begin with) isn't worth their few seconds of screen time. Especially since the time that takes can be devoted to other areas, and allow us to release the game out sooner. In KQ2VGA, you'll see a few ripped KQ5 animations, but many more new original ones. If we had to make all the ripped ones from scratch it would probably take another 6 months or so to release.

Finally, in most Sierra sequels, you'll see the same animations re-used for the main character. QFG3 and QFG4 for example. Just try to think of it as Tierra attempting to make the games look as much like the original Sierra games as possible. We want to make it look and feel like you're playing a real sierra game.

Edited by: Anonymous Game Creator 2 at: 6/27/02 9:32:28 am

[Erpy]

By the way, Heyjupiter, I just removed your previous post as you pretty much posted the same thing here.

Don't take it personal, I'm just trying to make sure the forums don't get cluttered up.

[Fender178]

man im running out of ideas for a future remake becuase some of the game mention in the poll besides kq3 i have never played well l played lb for about 2 secs.

[YODAM]

In my mind LB1 would be the best choice. I dont mind the other ones tho.

Y LB1- well the fact is i couldn't beat it? I know thats sad. Even with the walkthrough (shudders) i couldn't. it just wouldn't let my find the darn stuff in the paper basket and such. Heck i wuz stumped on how to get the key in the key hole in the elevator. I think that this really needs an update! cuz the 2nd one rocked my world!

[TheMnomen]

Yeah, SQ1 was remade by Sierra, but so was KQ1, and in my opinion SQ1 vga's gfx were very close to that of the KQ1 vga.

[DasJan]

There was no KQ1VGA by Sierra. They remade the game in EGA. But there is a SQ1VGA by Sierra.

By the way: Great demo! Thanks for releasing it

Das Jan

---
www.dasjan.de | www.adventure-treff.de

[Fender178]

ya sq1vga was the only vga remake by sierra. and one of the reasons that they didnt do any more remakes is because it probaly cost too much money.

[Erpy]

Sierra's remakes weren't really succesful, even though I must say I liked them. KQ1SCI was quite an improvement in mood from the AGI-version for example. Still, QG1VGA and SQ1VGA had timer-problems and when Sierra released them, you paid the full price for something you basically owned already. Also plenty of gamers said that the remakes ruined the nostalgic mood. (I don't remember ever hearing that complaint about KQ1VGA) Because of the impopularity, Sierra stopped remaking their old EGA-games. They hardly (if at all) made a profit.

What I think is that the games were just a little bit too young at that time. The adventure genre was still booming and there were plenty of new adventures to spend your money on. Sierra tried to revive games that weren't dead yet.

Interesting thing to think about, hmmm? Sierra's remakes flopped more or less, KQ1VGA was quite succesful. It's likely that it also has something to do with the fact that we're not the big, wealthy Sierra, so people set lower standards for fan-teams than they would set for a commercial company.

[TheMnomen]

Oh yeah! Der.... you're right.

[Wolfgang Abenteuer]

Well, I personally enjoyed both SQ1VGA and QFG1VGA. QFG1VGA was actually the first QFG I played, so to me it WAS the nostalgic mood. If I didn't have such horrendous problems running on my computer now, I'd likely play it through at least once a week.

As for what Erpy said about people having lower expectations from a fan game, I think he's right. Nobody could really expect a group of fans, who are not paid and who are doing a project completely in their spare time, could produce a game that is of commercial, professional caliber. That's why I think KQ1VGA just blew everyone away. I don't think even Sierra themselves could have done a better job with a remake at the time they were remaking QFG and SQ, and it completely took fans off-guard. I was impressed (and still am ) with KQ1VGA.

~Wolfgang

[Fender178]

why didnt kq1 didnt get the vga remake by sierra? if sq1 did and some others.