The Gamers Thread: PS3, PC, Wii, 360... pick your poison!!

[Spikey]

I really don't understand how people can live without Mario, Peach Toadstool, Toad, Link, Zelda, Samus Aran, Fox McCloud, Pikachu, Captain Falcon......

[Angelus3K]

I know what you mean Spikey Mario is fantastic, I loved Mario World on Snes and Yoshi's Island was my fav game, but I think one day soon Nintendo will probably turn like Sega and make there games for other consoles.

Of course it depends what console they bring out next but the next big battle will be PS3 and Xbox 2 and even then PS3 has a larger, older fan base.

Thats also why I love my PS2 Snes emulator lol!!!

[Spikey]

Nintendo does intend to be last I believe, they are running fast with GameCube 2. And Xbox is hardly a battle, cause worldwide it simply sells....bad......

Nintendo's biggest mistake was to let playstation go and release a SNES instead.

[Angelus3K]

What I read happened was that Nintendo asked Sony if they could build a CD-Rom drive add-on for the Snes, the deal was going fine until Nintendo apparantly crossed Sony and signed up with Philips to make the CD-Rom drive.

Sony were pissed and decided to make their own console. The Playstation!

[Spikey]

???? No I don't believe it was not intended as an add on....as soon as CDs were getting more regular, nintendo was in seriousness developing something CDonly. But then, they decided not to do it, cause the world was not ready for CDs or something. But it's a long time since I last read it. Ahg. I dunno.

[VampD3]

OMG!!!!!!

http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/adventure/r ... 92360.html

Resi Evil: Outbreak is released in USA today (or yesterday) but the PAL (European) version comes out in September!! AND has NO ONLINE PLAY!!!! Whereas the US can play upto 4 people!

That is so unfair!!! We europeans just get 2 dumbass CPU controlled people to help whilst US gamers can play together!

This is an outrage!! I want a GC!

Edit: And for godsake next time I forget to log in im gonna slap myself!! - Ang

[Spikey]

Let's face it again. GameCube ownz.

[Angelus3K]

Well I just read that the PAL version of Outbreak will have something the NTSC version doesnt, which is 2 player mode so thats cool.

But I cant wait till September for Outbreak to come out here so I'm downloading it now!! 3GB!!!

[Broomie]

Let's face it again. GameCube ownz.

It sure does pawtna!

[Skyshark]

I love Timesplitters 2. I've just about unlocked everything in that game (got all the characters, now all I have to do is finish the game on Hard and I'll unlock the final deathmatch level, the building site! I need to organise with my friends (a couple of which have PS2s) for a large-scale deathmatch one day.

One game I'm waiting for is Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow. The X-Box version is already out, but I'm waiting for the PS2 version, which shouldn't be too far away here in Oz. I loved the original Splinter Cell(very challenging, stealthy stuff), so this one ought to be a blast. The online component ought to last for some time.

[Angelus3K]

I never liked Splinter Cell but maybe that was just because I played it on my Xbox (before I sold it) and hated the controls because of the chunky crap controller (which was why I sold it).

Maybe I'll give Pandora a spin....

[Kami]

I have all three consoles. But I do love the 'Cube. Games I bought ages ago are still playable. X-Box and PS2 have very few games of that calibur.


Theres one thing about the next generation of consoles - Nintendo may have the one feature that really helped the PS2. Backwards Compatability. Well, I'm guessing more emulation, but thats a guess. So far, PS3 is coming close to ruling it out and I haven't heard if X-Box 2 offers backwards compatability.


One small point about the 'cube is it has done better financially than the X-Box because Nintendo are shrewd at keeping costs down. X-Box is making losses left, right and centre - and those are not being backed up with healthy software sales. Nintendo have the advantage there by having decent software sales and the GBA (Which has sold amazingly well - 20 million GBASP's in the US alone. Healthy sales).


I think N5 is sounding very interesting. And it may have an edge if it's the only console that ofers a good back-catalog already there.


Nintendo have never been the leaders. The Master System dominated the NES. The Mega Drive was more commercially viable than the Mega Drive. PS beat the N64. PS2 has beaten the 'Cube.

But I wouldn't be putting money on the N5 meeting the same fate. Nintendo seem very serious, and I wonder if the "Nintendo DS" is just a taste of things to come... something different, something revolutionary and not at all what we expect...

The next generation of consoles is shaping up to be a very interesting showdown.

[Spikey]

Nintendo have never been the leaders. The Master System dominated the NES. The Mega Drive was more commercially viable than the Mega Drive. PS beat the N64. PS2 has beaten the 'Cube.

Depends on what you call leading. In early days, Nintendo games were the most revolutionary. Donkey Kong and Super Mario Bros for example. In some countries the NES and SNES dominated big time over MS and MD.

[Kami]

Nintendo are still revolutionary. Nintendo were the first to go for the rumble feature, for example, in the controller itself and not as a clunky backpack. The GBPlayer. The 64DD. The Virtual Boy. And now the Dual Screen.

And yes, in Japan - Nintendo are dominant along with the PS2. We westerners seem to have a hard time getting to grips with Nintendo though (Although to be fair I am 1/2 Japanese so I don't count.) - but X-Box has proven that western consoles really don't do well in the east.

So, on balance, Nintendo are doing better than X-Box. Microsoft however can take that punishment... I just wonder - for how long?

[anathoth8]

The Master System dominated the NES. The Mega Drive was more commercially viable than the Mega Drive.

Bull. Show me some numbers to back up this claim. The Master System came out after the NES and the only software available for it were rehashes of old arcade games that most folks had already gotten their fill of. It couldn't compete with the original new games on the NES like Mario and Zelda. It wasn't until the Genesis (Mega Drive) that Sega's sales started to pick up with the release of its new game Sonic the Hedgehog.

I don't know exactly what you mean by "more commercially viable" but I'm not sure that I believe this either. (I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you didn't mean to compare the Mega Drive to the Mega Drive) Sure, the Genesis came out before the SNES, but if I remember right, it was quite expensive comparatively.

As for the origin of the Playstation, it was indeed developed by Sony as an add-on for the SNES. However, under their agreement, Sony would own the rights to collect from developers who wanted their game on the discs. Once Nintendo realized that CD-ROMs were coming to stay, they ditched Sony and made a new agreement with Phillips in which they owned the rights to the discs. Before this new add-on system was realeased, though, Nintendo decided that an add-on would not be as viable as they thought (possibly based on Sega's poor sales with their add-on CD system). At that point, Nintendo cut Phillips loose. You may remember that Phillips also released their system, now in stand alone form. It was called the CD-i.

[Spikey]

Indeed, it must be bull. Super Mario Bros raised the sales of the NES way out of the ceiling, and then Super Mario Bros 3 raised it again. And Zelda. And a whole lot of other games.

[Klytos]

Nintendo have never been the leaders. The Master System dominated the NES. The Mega Drive was more commercially viable than the Mega Drive. PS beat the N64. PS2 has beaten the 'Cube.

Not here in Australia. When the battle was between NES and Master System II, the only real option was the NES. Both consoles were selling for about the same price, but the games you wanted to play were on the NES. Mario 3 alone made up my mind, the closest Sega ever got at that stage to mario was Alex the Kid in Miracle World and lets face it, you can only play rock paper sissors so many times before it's really really lame.

[Erpy]

But Phantasy Star did provide some tough competition for Final Fantasy 1.

[Angelus3K]

God I remember my friend playing Phantasy Star for hours on end!!

He had this cheat thing for the dungeons where you moved a little then paused the game then moved some more and paused again etc and this greatly decreased your chance of a random enemy encounter.

I never really play PS before are they worth playing?

[Erpy]

PS1: Yep. This game probably had the best graphics of any 8-bit game that was released at its time. There's a very limited amount of spells, but the game's actually great fun and quite challenging too. (the real cheat, btw, is that you can use a second wand you buy as a reusable escaper. )

PS2: Rather fun, but really hard. This one probably takes you months. Tough bosses, tough random encounters and it takes quite a long time to build up levels or gain enough money to buy new equipment.

PS3: So-so. I didn't like the battle system. The "generations"-system is a creative approach though. Doesn't really tie in with the other PS-games story-wise.

PS4: My favourite RPG together with Lunar. Other than the fact that it's rather linear and rather easy, you'll have fun every minute of it. Cool combat system, cool characters, awesome cutscenes, nice dialogues and well, a lot of fun all-around. It contains one hell of a lot of references to previous PS-games, but is still fun on its own. Did I mention it's fun to play? I always thought this game is better at drawing you into the story than its Final Fantasy equivalents on the SNES.

PS-online: Never played it.

[Kami]

Sales figures for the MS in Europe outweighed the NES. Slightly, but still. That generation was close because no-one else really butted in.

It was the SNES that took a real beating. If I remember the last report I saw on that debate, the Mega Drive/Genesis outsold the SNES 3 to 1.

That was not because SNES was crap. These beating are not because Nintendo are bad. The Genesis was cooler. Sleeker. More in tune with the market, the start of "fashionable consoles". In comparison on looks, SNES didn't have a hope in hells chance.

SEGA also had their "anti-Mario", Sonic. And it is easy to forget how popular Sonic was and still is (Despite being crap, Sonic Heroes is still one of the 10 best selling titles this year. Ugh.) - Nintendo did good business and fended off the rest of the competition.


The N64 is where it started to go all pear-shaped. Now, N64 was still a class console. But Nintendo didn't realise how expensive consoles would be compared to the cheap CD format. Also, N64 was still chunky and large, the controller looked like a device of torture (Which I cane to love!). Nintendo did have one star turn. They had Pokemon. And we all know how much that dominated the market - and how it still dominates the market, though the craze is significantly more calm now than it used to be. Still, N64 did pretty poorly. Thankfully, not as poorly as the Saturn (And even that didn't deserve to die. NiGHTS, anyone?).


The 'Cube has been a step in the right direction though. First up, it has power. More power than the PS2. And more harnessed than most X-Box material. It's small. It still looks odd, but it's a very small machine. The controller is surprisingly sleek (though the D-Pad could have been done better) and easy to use. Their MD's are cheap to produce and can contain serious amounts of data.

Where Nintendo went wrong? I don't think they DID do anything wrong this time around, except let RARE go too easily (Y'know. Rare. Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Banjo Kazooie, Conkers Bad Fur Day?) - Rare flourished under Nintendo. Nintendo have standards but they are surprisingly leniant on their developers and give them a lot of creative space. When Nintendo let Rare go to MicroSoft, it was a huge mistake.

And to be honest, since Conker, Rare haven't really done much of note. They're not doing so well under Microsoft. And last I heard, MS was letting games and developers go because they are trying to cut losses... I hope Rare is one of that list so they can get back to proper development.


Nintendo also did one thing unexpected: they bought some exclusivity from Capcom for Resident Evil. Not QUITE expected, but it was a double-edged sword. On the PLUS side, RE4 couldn't be done on the PS2 and it is doubtful half the stuff could be done on an X-Box either (Since 'Cube uses a different set of graphical hardware mainly). The remake, and RE0 are certainly two of the most beautiful games out there. Also a plus is that it gave Nintendo some much-needed adult appeal.
The problem came from many RE fans. I know this one for a fact because I hung around many RE boards a while ago. Fans were HORRIFIED! It didn't make sense, RE was a PS game. Branching out and making these titles 'Cube only caused a bit of a backlash.


Also, a weakness of Nintendo (which you wouldn't have guessed from Pokemon!) is they are surprisingly not that good at advertising. PS2 and X-Box have agressive TV marketing. Only in the last month have Nintendo really started following suit in Europe with some rather eye-catching ads.



None of this is Nintendo's fault really. It is just others have really had more marketing success.




And yes. I am interested in the console MARKET, more than just gaming. It's rather interesting once you get into it...


All said though, Nintendo won't be the LOSERS this time around... sadly, that honour will go to MicroSoft who will have to nurse their losses for a while to come. MS's problem is obvious... with so much power and the hard drive and all the extras... it costs more to make an X-Box than it does to sell. Not uncommon, PS2 took that gamble - the difference is, PS2 had the software sales to back it up. X-Box hasn't had that luxury.



All well and good saying which console is the best - could stand here for hours debating that, and which consoles have fared better throughout history. In the end, success boils down to how the companies have done financially... the clear winner is obvious, we KNOW who's coming out of this generation with a nice fat wallet of cash. But it will be interesting to see Nintendo's final 'Cube report late 2005/early 2006, and see just how well/poorly it has done... I think it may surprise us all.

[Spikey]

My favorite RPGs are Secret of Mana and Lufia for the SNES.

Sales figures for the MS in Europe outweighed the NES. Slightly, but still. That generation was close because no-one else really butted in.

What are your sources? Actually, in Holland MS failed in every way.

It was the SNES that took a real beating. If I remember the last report I saw on that debate, the Mega Drive/Genesis outsold the SNES 3 to 1.

SNES lasted very long, way too long actually, when the MD was already dead, up until the Lufia (II: Fortress of Doom) release, which was the very last SNES killer I believe.

That was not because SNES was crap. These beating are not because Nintendo are bad. The Genesis was cooler. Sleeker. More in tune with the market, the start of "fashionable consoles". In comparison on looks, SNES didn't have a hope in hells chance.

What do you mean with looks??? Graphics? Donkey Kong Country was the ultimate 16bit videogame, very fashionable...Design? JP and Euro SNES design was very fashionable.

And looks aren't everything. Ever played Mortal Kombat 2 on the Genesis? That was a crappy interface with 4 buttons. The only thing better on the Genesis was Jurassic Park I hated the SNES version.

SEGA also had their "anti-Mario", Sonic. And it is easy to forget how popular Sonic was and still is (Despite being crap, Sonic Heroes is still one of the 10 best selling titles this year. Ugh.) - Nintendo did good business and fended off the rest of the competition.

I believe Sonic was meant to be a joke (like Mario) nothing seriousness, and there certainly was no aim for Sonic to compete with Mario, it was the fans who did that (like I'm doing now). Is Sonic Heroes crap? I intended to buy it. Why is it crap?

The N64 is where it started to go all pear-shaped. Now, N64 was still a class console. But Nintendo didn't realise how expensive consoles would be compared to the cheap CD format. Also, N64 was still chunky and large, the controller looked like a device of torture (Which I cane to love!).

Truth.

Nintendo did have one star turn.

You forget the Zelda games on the N64 were among the greatest of all games in history, as many people will say after me. Ocarina of Time is probably the best Nintendo game ever developed (at least fanpolls tell us that fans do think that). Also, Goldeneye was Nintendo exclusive and a straight hit. And Super Smash Bros. And Banjo Kazooie. And Mario Party was still new then. Mario Kart was kind of a let down though, although I thought it was good.

They had Pokemon. And we all know how much that dominated the market - and how it still dominates the market, though the craze is significantly more calm now than it used to be. Still, N64 did pretty poorly. Thankfully, not as poorly as the Saturn

Pokemon only sells well on the Gameboy, but it was not their only star like I said.....And BTW, Pokemon isn't calm at all, instead, sales peak against expectations of Nintendo.

Where Nintendo went wrong? I don't think they DID do anything wrong this time around, except let RARE go too easily (Y'know. Rare. Goldeneye, Perfect Dark, Banjo Kazooie, Conkers Bad Fur Day?) - Rare flourished under Nintendo. Nintendo have standards but they are surprisingly leniant on their developers and give them a lot of creative space. When Nintendo let Rare go to MicroSoft, it was a huge mistake. And to be honest, since Conker, Rare haven't really done much of note. They're not doing so well under Microsoft. And last I heard, MS was letting games and developers go because they are trying to cut losses... I hope Rare is one of that list so they can get back to proper development.

Nintendo still has connections with Rare (Donkey Kong for the GBA, Starfox Adventures?). They were very useful in the past, but I think they are running behind now, and that Nintendo didn't really like their latest stuff.

Also a plus is that it gave Nintendo some much-needed adult appeal.

That didn't came from Resident Evil only, I mean, the average age of Cubers has been 30 since the beginning.

Also, a weakness of Nintendo (which you wouldn't have guessed from Pokemon!) is they are surprisingly not that good at advertising. PS2 and X-Box have agressive TV marketing. Only in the last month have Nintendo really started following suit in Europe with some rather eye-catching ads.

I agree. Some games just need promotion, especially Nintendo's own new titles. They didn't receive the attention they needed.

None of this is Nintendo's fault really. It is just others have really had more marketing success. And yes. I am interested in the console MARKET, more than just gaming. It's rather interesting once you get into it... All said though, Nintendo won't be the LOSERS this time around... sadly, that honour will go to MicroSoft

I'm interested in the market as well, I one day hope to make my job out of it and you are right: people always have positive attitudes towards Nintendo.

All well and good saying which console is the best - could stand here for hours debating that, and which consoles have fared better throughout history. In the end, success boils down to how the companies have done financially... the clear winner is obvious, we KNOW who's coming out of this generation with a nice fat wallet of cash. But it will be interesting to see Nintendo's final 'Cube report late 2005/early 2006, and see just how well/poorly it has done... I think it may surprise us all.

Well, we'll see what the future brings

[Angelus3K]

Sony have been pretty clever though with their ads and espeically the console itself, I mean its backwards compatible they've released a network adapter for it and have now just launched the hard drive add-on in US.

There is another thing though that has given the PS2 a slight unofficial edge in that its probably the easiest console to use mod chips with and has a great selection of homebrew software and games.

I mean you can frickin play Mega Drive and Snes on a PS2!!!

[anathoth8]

SNES lasted very long, way too long actually, when the MD was already dead, up until the Lufia (II: Fortress of Doom) release, which was the very last SNES killer I believe.

I think that a big part of Sega's problem was the premature move toward CD-ROMs. I truly believe that in this regard, Sega was unfortunately ahead of its time. The gaming market just wasn't ready for CD-ROM yet. Not to mention the fact that the technology was horrendously expensive at that time. Sega's other problem was that it continued to try to milk the Genesis (Mega Drive) with expansions for too long, then charging the gamer full console price for the add-on.

I believe Sonic was meant to be a joke (like Mario) nothing seriousness, and there certainly was no aim for Sonic to compete with Mario, it was the fans who did that (like I'm doing now).

Actually, that's not true. At that time, there were very stiff battles between the competition of Sega and Nintendo, especially in advertising. You may remember Sega's slogan "Sega does what Nintendon't".

Nintendo still has connections with Rare (Donkey Kong for the GBA, Starfox Adventures?).

Starfox Adventures was Rare's last game for any Nintendo system. During the sale of Rare, Nintendo withheld the rights to their own trademarks, which includes Starfox, Donkey Kong, etc. That's why you will still see Donkey Kong games on the GBA and Cube; they are still owned by Nintendo.

There is another thing though that has given the PS2 a slight unofficial edge in that its probably the easiest console to use mod chips with and has a great selection of homebrew software and games.

That doesn't really have anything to do with Sony, though. It is neither condoned nor supported. Besides, the Xbox can be modded rather easily as well. I don't know about the Cube; I haven't heard anything about people modding it.

[Spikey]

Actually, that's not true. At that time, there were very stiff battles between the competition of Sega and Nintendo, especially in advertising. You may remember Sega's slogan "Sega does what Nintendon't".

I meant the development of Sonic himself as a character was not aimed at Mario directly, although advertisement may have flamed Nintendo. But that sort of advertisement was forbidden back then here in the Netherlands.

During the sale of Rare, Nintendo withheld the rights to their own trademarks, which includes Starfox, Donkey Kong, etc. That's why you will still see Donkey Kong games on the GBA and Cube; they are still owned by Nintendo.

Yeah that's what I mean. I know Rare doesn't own the characters, but it's funny to see another Donkey Kong Country (DKC Advance this time ) with Rare in it rereleased after the whole thing ended.

Grtz,
Spikey