Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

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Gualtier0 · #1 Post by **Gualtier0** » Mon Feb 24, 2003 7:27 pm

Some things I noticed while playing King's Quest 2. Perhaps some of them are not even bugs, but deliberate choices. In the second book you read in the town library there is written "it's apex" which should be "its apex". When Graham tries to push the Hagatha into the cauldron, no music is played at the death message. Hagatha keeps babbling for a very long time when she discovers Graham in her cave after she has finished chanting. At the third test for the Growth Gem, you always receive a point, whether you crown Connor or not. The Spirit of the Cloud, however, strongly prefers the first option, I came to understand. Drinking the youth potion while you are stuck in the bridge doesn't show an animation. Why doesn't the emerald protect you against Hagatha's magic? The magic book doesn't say that the emerald only works against enchanters' magic. When you meet the lions at the quartz tower, they tell you that only one of them tells the truth. But is that assertion true or false? Or both? It seems for once the lying lion is telling the truth, thus making the assertion false and lying anyway, but then the assertion should be true...? Kind of a paradox it seems to me. Do with these remarks as you see fit. Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub57.ezboard.com/broyalquestfor ... altier0</A> at: 2/24/03 1:34:04 pm

#2 Post by **Anonymous Game Creator 2** » Mon Feb 24, 2003 8:43 pm

When Graham tries to push the Hagatha into the cauldron, no music is played at the death message. Ah, this is no doubt related to the Hagatha babbling on for too long bug. The music that plays while she babbles is actually supposed to be the death music, but since she talks for so long the music finishes playing before the restore/restart/quit box even appears. I'll fix this up. At the third test for the Growth Gem, you always receive a point, whether you crown Connor or not. The Spirit of the Cloud, however, strongly prefers the first option, I came to understand. This is intentional. Some people liked MOE, while others hated it. Therefore, the individual player wasn't punished for their choice when it came to points. The Cloud spirit, on the other hand, judges Graham on the wisdom of his decision. Drinking the youth potion while you are stuck in the bridge doesn't show an animation. Fixed this one already. Actually, I disabled it altogether<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /smile.gif ALT=":)"> Why doesn't the emerald protect you against Hagatha's magic? The magic book doesn't say that the emerald only works against enchanters' magic. Hagatha uses fatal spells. The enchanter merely casts enchantments which transform the state and appearance of things into other things. The emerald can undo an enchantment, but it can't bring people back from the dead if they've been zapped. When you meet the lions at the quartz tower, they tell you that only one of them tells the truth. But is that assertion true or false? Or both? It seems for once the lying lion is telling the truth, thus making the assertion false and lying anyway, but then the assertion should be true...? Kind of a paradox it seems to me. The assertion itself is always true, regardless of what either lion statue says. The lying lion told the truth - but by doing so, he ended up lying about being a liar. Kind of hipocritical on his part, but still a lie, nevertheless<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /smile.gif ALT=":)"> Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub57.ezboard.com/broyalquestfor ... >Anonymous Game Creator 2</A> at: 2/24/03 2:45:38 pm

Gualtier0 · #3 Post by **Gualtier0** » Mon Feb 24, 2003 10:57 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Fixed this one already. Actually, I disabled it altogether<hr></blockquote> Just as well I suppose. We can't have babies falling down chasms in decent adventure games. <blockquote>Quote:<hr> The assertion itself is always true, regardless of what either lion statue says. The lying lion told the truth - but by doing so, he ended up lying about being a liar. Kind of hipocritical on his part, but still a lie, nevertheless<hr></blockquote> Hmmmmm, nice try. But I don't buy it. The same assertion is told by both lions. So the assertion has to be both true and false. But it is true, of course (we know that). Thus the lying lion tells the truth, and doesn't always lie. The fact alone that the lying lion can also make true statements makes the puzzle inconsistent. Because you cannot be sure anymore if the lying lion is lying. To say even more: if the lying lion isn't always making false statements, the truthful lion isn't always telling the truth! Because in saying that the other lion always lies, he tells a lie himself. So they can both lie and tell the truth. So you can never tell which one of them holds the correct solution to the door puzzle, except for trying both solutions of course. There. I know I am being very annoying, but is really is inconsistent. Isn't it easier to let a plaque appear, telling Graham about the lions or something? Or even better, do not tell anything at all, but let the player figure it out himself? The puzzle itself is very consistent, after all. You don't need the introduction to know which one is the right solution. Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub57.ezboard.com/broyalquestfor ... altier0</A> at: 2/24/03 4:58:43 pm

Wolfgang Abenteuer · #4 Post by **Wolfgang Abenteuer** » Mon Feb 24, 2003 11:56 pm

So, in other words, if you were to ask each lion "Are you the lying lion?" or such and each lion were to answer "No", you'd be satisfied, then? Wow...this reminds me of that "The Cretian said that all Cretians are liars." thing they made us try to figure out in my 9th grade English class. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... tongue.gif ALT=":p"> ~Wolfgang

Gualtier0 · #5 Post by **Gualtier0** » Tue Feb 25, 2003 2:23 pm

Yes, that's a good idea. Let them say something like "Only I speak the truth and the other is a liar". That way they can say the same, but they are posing two different assertions with the same words and thus the one can be lying and the other one speak the truth. I didn't think of that one. That would be the perfect solution.

optic · #6 Post by **optic** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 2:58 pm

...My brain hurts from all this comparsion...<img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/roll.gif ALT=":rollin">

Zeus · #7 Post by **Zeus** » Sun Apr 13, 2003 3:16 pm

Both gualtier0 AND designer of puzzle are right, i think! Gualtier you should not make things so complicated : If the lion-liar says "one of us tells the truth" it means in other words that either 1)both lions tell the truth :rejected because they make different statements 2)both of them say lie :rejected as well, because the puzzle is (and MUST) be solved by one lion's statement.So one lion says the truth, and both lions say a make a statement which is true in order to HELP player, and not to confuse him with complicated assumptions. Thus obviously the liar lion says the truth at his sentence, and there is no paradox. A logic paradox would arise if each lion accused the OTHER lion of not saying the truth! like the one with the Cretians (nice example wolfbang! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /smile.gif ALT=":)"> i know it because i am greek <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/pimp.gif ALT=":hat"> ) But there is something else: One should take for granted that the fact that one lion lies, applies ONLY for the statement they make regarding the solution of the particular puzzle! So the liar , lies only for the challenge of the puzzle,only for the particular occasion in order to test graham's intelligence or more accurate : graham's good luck, or if graham is methodical, and saved before the puzzle! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... s/wink.gif ALT=";)"> All other statements are sincere from the liar lion. So we should assume that when they say BOTH "one says the truth and one says lie", it is a true statement. And in other words as in real life, if one person happens to say a lie once that does not mean that EVERYTHING he/she says is a lie for the rest of his/her life ! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/im ... /smile.gif ALT=":)"> (a portion of them however has a tendency to become proffesional liars later) And of course there are some people who tell only lies, but this is a different category i think (professional liars).

Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Re: Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Re: Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Re: Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Re: Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

Re: Various minor bugs and inconsistensies in KQ2.

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